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2008 ARCHIVE of PAST POSTS
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2008 Classroom Management Forum Archive of Past Posts
2007 Classroom Management Forum Archive of Past Posts
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Here's a comprehensive archive of all past posts from 2008-- with all our suggestions for classroom management strategies, defiance, Asperger's, conduct disorder, oppositional behavior, delinquency, bad attitudes, thought disorders, ADHD, ADD, tardiness, work refusers, depression, trauma, family problems, substance abuse concerns, bus riding behavior, peer interaction skills, social behavior, cafeteria behavior, playground behavior-- even disrespect for teachers. Plus, you will find answers for every imaginable classroom management concern. Teaching and counseling doesn't has to be so difficult with all the terrific, new techniques included in our 2008 classroom management archive. Your class management concerns stop here. To get immediate answers and fast help, read our responses to past classroom management forum questions from 2008.

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QUESTIONS shown in GREEN
ANSWERS shown in BLUE

Date: 2008-07-17 09:27:03
Name: Jenna Subject: On-Site Workshops Job Title: Principal, School District Asst. Supt. Number: 31

I work at a rural school district that needs teacher professional development this fall for the new school year. How do we find out more information on teacher inservice training that would also be valuable staff professional development for principals, school counselors, psychologists, social workers, aides, classified employees and administrators? Is the workshop presentation interactive and who sets the content for the seminar? Is the workshop more of a conference or more of a traditional inservice seminar that teachers go through each new school year?

Our school district professional development training is just utterly unlike any seminar or workshop that your staff have experienced. Your staff set the agenda by naming the problem areas that they wish to cover. We are ready to cover any problem from ADD to Zero Interest in School. The training seminar is very interactive and is perfect for anyone who works with angry, violent, depressed, withdrawn, or failing students. More information can be obtained by calling 800-545-5736, or you can email us (link at bottom of every page). Or click here to visit our On-Site Professional Development Workshop and Presentation area. We can mail you additional information upon your request. Best of all: Our on-site workshops solve your worst "kid problems" and are surprisingly affordable.

Reply written by Ruth Herman Wells, M.S., Director, Youth Change at 2008-07-17 09:31:54

Date: 2008-07-17 02:58:16 Name: seema Subject: math Job Title: teacher Number: 30

I work with Juvenille affenders and I teach math. I am looking for ways to keep them calm and when theya re defiant how to intervene. Most of the students are masters of manipulations and its hard to differentiate between truth and manipulations sometimes.

Most of the students that you describe as manipulators, mental health professionals call conduct disordered. Most delinquents are conduct disordered. It is amazing that to this day, staff who work with juvenile delinquents are still not provided even the most rudimentary or basic training on conduct disorders. This is especially true since you can not use ordinary approaches with conduct disorders. As you have learned ordinary methods fail miserably. The book (or instant download ebook) that can explain it all is here (click). There are also dozens of pages on conduct disorders on our site that give introductory information. Start here. Until you acquire more targeted methods for working with conduct disorders, you will continue to have the behavior problems.

Last edited by Ruth Herman Wells, M.S., Director, Youth Change at 2008-07-17 09:13:40

Date: 2008-04-27 14:54:36 Name: Evelyn Riquelme Subject: Classroom mangement technics Job Title: Asst Principal Number: 29

Looking for information on classroom management technics. Such as students raising their hand. Why is it important to have clear boundaries.

We have thousands of classroom management techniques, many on our site, most in our workshop and books. We have so many that I am at a loss where to send you. Here’s a list of our help articles on the subject but there are hundreds more classroom management interventions on our site. They can put you back in charge of the classroom and school. The place to start getting our classroom management help is here: click. This page is sorted by subject so scroll down to Classroom and Group Management Skills. It is fairly far down the page under the headline of Articles Sorted by Topic. You should also read the articles under Violent, Oppositional, and Conduct Disordered Students. You may be very surprised at what you read. We get vice principals emailing us all the time to thank us for those articles. As for the boundaries, they are to control what an engine is to a car. You can have a car without an engine but you’re not going anywhere. Consider coming to one of our workshops for our full help; workshop information is here; click

Last edited by Ruth Herman Wells, M.S., Director, Youth Change at 2008-04-29 16:42:43

Date: 2008-04-25 12:33:07
Name: Veronica Subject: troubled kids Job Title: Program Facilitator/A.S. Program Number: 28

Hello, I need your help, I work with 80 kids in an after school program. We have kids from all grades, but we had about 10-15 trouble 5th grade students. I ran out of techniques of how to deal with their behavior, nothing seems to work. We had had taken their recess or fun time off, we speak with their parents about the situation. We now are writting them up, but everthing seems to work only for a short period of time. How should we deal with their back talk, disrespect, and hostility.?

Please give us some suggestions.

Thanks,

Veronica and Staff.

Consequences and write-ups don’t teach children skills. Teach your students the exact skills you want them to do then motivate them to do so. Teach these skills just like you teach writing or math. Note that you could offer consequences to students who couldn’t spell but the consequences wouldn’t help them spell any better. The same logic is true for using proper school behavior. There are dozens of articles how-to articles on this throughout our site. Find a lot of these articles here; click. I especially recommend “Got Defiant, Argumentative, Angry and Difficult Students? Win the Power Struggles Every Time.” Bottom line: If consequences could powerfully transform behavior then students would all be well-behaved. Consequences are no substitute for teaching students to look, act, and sound like students.

Last edited by Ruth Herman Wells, M.S., Director, Youth Change at 2008-04-29 16:34:09

Date: 2008-04-23 09:23:11 Name: Teacher Subject: Defiance Job Title: Intervention Specialist Number: 27

I have a 10 year old boy in my class who has reactive attachment disorder. He's been in my class for about 4 months and has been having very bad behavior outbursts the past week or so, in his foster home and at school. I can make the simplest request (like put your papers in your backpack to take home) and he'll refuse. When I try to get him to time out for his defiance (time to calm down until he's ready to follow directions) he refuses and becomes very aggressive. We have had to restrain him and he bites, kicks, punches, etc. I'd appreciate any feedback to assist!

This sounds a bit extreme for reactive attachment disorder so a second opinion might not be a bad idea. Ask them to rule out conduct disorder because what you describe is more consistent with that. You approach attachment disorder and conduct disorder very differently. If he is reactive attachment disordered, you probably see him having these huge swings in how he reacts. He should be really positive and pretty up some times and then really aggressive at other times. You're the worst teacher ever, he says, then you are the best teacher ever another day. The boy has a heart but the emotional issues dominate. (This is still different from bi-polar by the way.) Do you see some positive not just violence? If so, work to moderate the swings in behavior so they're less extreme. It's hard to give you much depth in the tiny space this permits me but that's the goal. You can use rewards and consequences and skill building. There are hundreds of examples in our resources. Not seeing both positive and negative reactions? Get a second opinion before proceeding.

Last edited by Ruth Herman Wells, M.S., Director, Youth Change at 2008-04-29 16:34:09

Date: 2008-04-03 16:50:57
Name: Stephanie Subject: Child disturbance and classwork motivation Job Title: para-professional Number: 25

I work 1:1 with an ED student. His year has been going pretty well until about a month ago. He is defiant in everything that we do for him. We have tried every startegy possible in order for him to succeed. What it all really stems down to is that he does not want to do the work assigned to him and he acts out in order to get response from me, his teacher, his peers etc. Can you direct me to any positive behavior reinforcments that we can all use to make the rest of his school year a positive one! We have tried everything you can imagine from reward charts, sticker charts, modified assignments. He is such an angry child and we are all really worried about him and what lies ahead for his future if we don’t try to help him now while we still have a chance! Any suggestions/directions would be great! Thank you!!!!!!

Reply written by Ruth Herman Wells, M.S., Director, Youth Change at 2008-04-04 17:41:39

I don't think this is about positive behavior reinforcement. I think you need to determine if this is a child acting-out distress, or a child who is willfully defiant and completely unconcerned about his negative impact on others. You did not provide me enough data to know which is the case. Once you make that determination, you will know how to proceed. For a child who is acting out his pain, you want to help the child learn to vent in more socially appropriate ways. You will rely heavily on relationship-based approaches that strike the balance between the distress and providing education. For a child who is potentially conduct disordered (lacks conscience and relationship capacity) you must use completely different methods. Read more on conduct disorders here: http://www.youthchg.com/education.html#conduct. Read "Remedies That Work with Work Refusers" here: http://www.youthchg.com/articles.html.

Date: 2008-03-27 12:26:43
Name: Jill Subject: rumor spreading Job Title: Elementary Counselor Number: 24
I have a 5th grade student who transferred into our school from another school here in our district at the beginning of the year. She is hearing from students in her old school that there are rumors being spread about her. What are some skills I can share with her to help her with these accusations? She has had a great deal of turmoil in her life this school year and she doesn't need this added frustration.

Reply written by Ruth Herman Wells, M.S., Director, Youth Change at 2008-03-31 13:01:53

If the rumors are being spread at her old school you can re-focus her by noting that she is lucky that she has a clean slate at her new school. Help her to see that the old school is in her past, and she is lucky to be at a new site. Second, help her toughen up. If elementary school rumors are tough, wait for Cut-Throat Middle School. This is a good time to teach her about letting words roll off her back like water off a duck. Use this incident to make her a veteran at managing peer issues like negative rumors so she is sturdier by the time she hits middle school in a year or two. One approach: have her stop thinking about it since there is nothing she can do about the rumors anyway. When she starts to think about it, have her think "Cancel" to stop the thought.

Date: 2008-03-16 16:44:52 Name: Susan Patterson Subject: severe behavior challenges Job Title: first grade special education teacher Number: 23

I teach first grade CTT with a very small group of disadvantaged children. However four of these very young children, all boys, are quite violent. That means they bite, stab children with the tips of pencils, throw chairs and staplers etc at children and adults. Three of these disruptive children refuse to engage in any instruction at all--they rarely sit down long enough to attempt to do any work or listen to instruction or even to stories. My thought is, that if they could somehow be brought to become involved in classroom activities then the other behaviors might recede. Or at least, I'd have something to work with in terms of behavior modification if I could get them interested in classroom activities. Surprisingly, two of these boys are general education children. They have been referred for evaluation but the process is going nowhere since the parents are not cooperating. The other boy is special ed and will be shortly transfered to a more restrictive setting. So my question really concerns the two general ed kids who won't sit for instruction. My co-teacher and I have tried offering incentives, we make sure that the work is on the boys' levels, we try coordinating with parents to offer rewards both at school and at home for days when the boys choose to sit for instruction. But they won't take the bait. They run around the classroom, throwing things, and even run around the school building. The administration at my school doesn't offer much support and so it is left to the classroom teachers to solve these kinds of problems. Do you have any suggestions for us to try? We'd be grateful. Thanks.

If you had been trained as a counselor instead of a teacher, you would know the answer to this question. Counselors are routinely taught about conduct disorders, the most unmanageable of all students. They exist in large numbers, making up about 11-14% of the population. (Teachers are not routinely offered this vital information in college; I don't know why.) These youngsters are the most unmanageable students that exist. C.D. can only be diagnosed by a counselor, just like only counselors and doctors can diagnose ADHD. When you think you spot ADHD, you adjust accordingly. In the same way, you must adjust how you work with conduct disorders. Ordinary interventions fail with conduct disorders. There is your explanation for why "nothing works." Here is a link to an article that will give you basic, introductory information on what to do to get back in control of these hard-to-manage students: http://www.youthchg.com/education.html#conduct. Here is the link to a $15 book that will provide all you need to know to control your uncontrollable students: http://www.youthchg.com/guide.html#antisocial. You may start seeing results fairly quickly if you switch methods.

Last edited by Ruth Herman Wells, M.S., Director, Youth Change at 2008-03-18 11:21:39

Date: 2008-02-27 15:39:21 Name: Lisa Stone Subject: Stressed out ED teacher in out of control grades 1-3 Job Title: SED primary teacher Number: 22

I "teach" in a classroom for emotionally disturbed first through third graders. At the beginning of the year I had the class under control. Since January 2008, I received one 6 year old boy who has ODD,ADHD, Mood disorders. He is always defiant and creates havok in the classroom daily. He refuses to do anything he is told to do. He kicks other students, pushes chairs into them, throws furniture and other objects, crawls under desks, stands on desks and chairs and whatever else he can do to get attention. I have recommended that he be sent to a treatment center, but my supervisor says that he is a typical ED child. I got another student at the same time who is ADHD, ODD,mood disorders. She is also 6 years old. She screams at everyone including me. I am unable. She fights with the other students, name calling, refusing to do work, cooperate or anything else. The other students pick up on all of this noise, defiance and disrespect. There are two other girls who speak to me in nasty tones of voice and talk back all the time. Everyone else thinks its OK to talk like this to me. Another boy yells at me, argues with me daily and refuses to do anything he is told. This room is totally unmanagable and I don't want to back there. My principal is not supportive. I have a teacher aide who does support me in any way. In fact, if I tell them one thing, she does the opposite as if protecting those kids from me. I have asked for help, but I don't get and I am made to feel as all of this is my fault. HELP! I'm falling apart.

This situation sounds untenable. First, you need to update your skills for working with E.D. students. One of the most important things E.D. kids-- or all kids, actually-- need is to feel they are in a safe, controlled environment where somebody is in charge. They reliably deteriorate in all kinds of ways otherwise. That is what you are seeing in your classroom. This is serious. I can't squeeze a full solution for this big of a problem into a tiny space like this. Please consider coming to one of workshops. You will be able to name the problems and get flooded with solutions. See our workshop schedule here If you are on a bad budget, we have work study financial aid slots. If you can't come live, our recorded class info is here, click. Second, once you have upgraded your skills, start over. Shut down your class, rename it, start completely fresh. It will be much easier to start over than to do clean-up. There are no shortcuts to bypass these steps. I am concerned about safety issues. Please consider getting the full help you need from us or from somewhere else knowledgeable about E.D. students.

Last edited by Ruth Herman Wells, M.S., Director, Youth Change at 2008-02-28 14:32:41

Date: 2008-02-10 12:17:39 Name: J.Wails Subject: Difficult Group Job Title: Teacher Number: 21

I have taken over a Maternity (the third substitute with this class) leave. I have been told numerous times that this group is, in essence, "The Perfect Storm". Individually, the kids are very sweet and could easily be managed in different classes. 40% of my class has ADHD/ADD; two kids have severe Aspergers; half a dozen others are seeing counsellors, psychologists or therapists. It's not a group of psychopaths and they aren't terribly violent (though the Aspergers kids have a streak) but I'm getting near my wits end.

It's an Inquiry based program that many of the parents put their children in because they felt that "conventional education failed their kids". This explains the huge number of difficult students in this group (there are only about 4 students with no behavioural, social or learning difficulties) There are numerous challenges that this group has but the largest two that remain (I've sufficiently dealt with two of them): 1) Lack of respect for private property 2) Lack of respect for people There are 17 boys and 3 girls in this class and approximately half of them have issues with these two (some of them severe). I'm creating a disciplan right now but I am having a hard time brainstorming concequences for these two rules. ANY (and I mean ANY ideas) would be a great benefit to me. This is not a behaviour disorders class and it's become virtually impossible to keep up with curricular demands with this group. My P and VP are both very supportive and aware of my class's issues.

Reply written by Ruth Herman Wells, M.S., Director, Youth Change at 2008-02-11 16:18:50

Consequences are not sufficient to rein in all types of students. Expecting a few consequences to fit your entire range of students is like expecting a couple of text books to fit your entire range. You did such a good job of listing off the different types of students you serve. Now you need to develop a plan that fits the range. Part of the plan does need to be a VARIETY of consequences. Another part of the plan must be to TEACH the SKILLS students need to follow the rules. You will need to teach discussion skills, peer interaction skills or whatever areas that students need to master to comply with your regulations. Note that consequences will not compensate for missing skills. Expecting consequences to compensate for missing behavior skills is like expecting consequences to compensate for missing academic skills. Neither will work. For more details on what to do, click here: http://www.youthchg.com/special.html#1 and http://www.youthchg.com/conference.html for follow-up articles.

Date: 2008-02-07 08:07:45 Name: Juan Bedoy Subject: Students Job Title: Classroom Supervisor Number: 20

I am the in-school suspension room in my town's middle school. I'm looking for advice on how to deal with students that think school is a waste of time and dont really care about about thier education.

Wow. Asking us for ways to motivate students to care about school? That's like walking into McDonald's and asking if they've got any burgers. We've got so many methods to convince students that they can't even make it through the morning without education that I can't even figure out where to start. Let's have you first see some of our most powerful interventions, our posters. You don't have to buy the posters, you can just use the interventions pictured. Look at these posters first. Another place to see some terrific strategies for motivation is here; click. Want motivation-makers in one place? Our Maximum-Strength Motivation will help.

Last edited by Ruth Herman Wells, M.S., Director, Youth Change at 2008-02-07 16:26:45

Date: 2008-01-11 16:13:40 Name: Rayetta Subject: teacher stressed, needs classroom management ages 8-12 Job Title: Asst Director Number: 19

I work for Kindercare Learning Center, I have experienced a teacher who only deals with after schoolers, and she has about 22 by herself 3 of the children are on medication for calmness the teacher is in ratio with the kids we need help!!!!!!!!!!!!!! please give us some ideas.

You wouldn't be asking the question if the teacher-child ratio appeared safe, responsible and do-able. You know the answer. Improving your staff's training on classroom management could help but even the best classroom and group management skills are not going to be a cure-all for too many students and too few teachers. These are young children and their safety and education are of paramount importance. Proper staffing and training are critical. I don't know of any shortcuts or ideas to substitute.

Last edited by Ruth Herman Wells, M.S., Director, Youth Change at 2008-01-14 15:57:23

Date: 2008-01-04 16:25:44 Name: kbailey Subject: coping with behaviors Job Title: educational assistant Number: 18

I work in a primary class with a 5 yr old boy who was recently diagnosed with ODD. Academically he knows a fair amount such as numbers to 15, letters, (recognizing and printing). He is only coming half days as he cannot seem to handle more time, he refuses to participate in gym and music, in class discussions, often repeats words or phrases over and over, runs off, hides under the desk, throws objects, jumps on me, rips things off the walls, has tried to take things home that are not his, lays on the floor, hides on me, he refuses to work,often times says "it istoo hard for me",. When most of this behavior occurs he has a smile on his face like he is proud . He seems to have problems holding a writing object such as pencil, crayon, marker. He can print letters but uses all capitals and when I ask him to use lower case he has tears. I am searching for information that could enable me to set him up for successes. I always try to give consequences immediately following an unacceptable behavior but things don't seem to matter to him. You can only use a specific consequence for a limited time and then he doesn't seem to care. sometimes he is sent home but he enjoys this most times, I would so love to make a difference in this child's life and want to do the right thing as much as possible. Is there something that I could read that would benefit us/ Any advice?

Reply written by Ruth Herman Wells, M.S., Director, Youth Change at 2008-01-04 17:01:29

I can't diagnose long-distance, but what you describe is far more consistent with conduct disorder. In many regions, clinicians hesitate to diagnose CD because it is such a serious disorder, plus, there can be other reasons that make professionals avoid citing the correct diagnosis. I suggest you try to contact clinician who made diagnosis and ask if CD was a real possibility, but wasn't used for extraneous reasons. Either way, consider using many of our methods for CDs because they could really help-- especially with a younger child. Be sure you read up on CDs first as you make things worse if you don't thoroughly understand how to work with them. You must use special methods; conventional approaches always fail. I strongly suggest you get our Best Answers: Conduct Disorder book, which is at this link: http://www.youthchg.com/guide.html#antisocial. (Click). Typically, 11-14% of population are CDs, so this is info you need anyway.

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